MIDI only (SysEx) Editor, no USB

I only have the Midihub for a few days, but I really love it, highly recommended, and I will sing the song on other forae.

But I do miss the option to have it operate with USB in my DAWless setup. Let me explain:

I have this multi synth setup (Deluge, Virus, Zoia, MX-1, MB33 etc), and I like to operate it no computer attached. To make this all work I have all MIDI hooked up using a iConnectMIDI4+, which allows for all of it to be connected, either over DIN or over USB (many controllers these days). This works great, even with Midihub, as it is detected niceley when connected USB only, so nothing wrong yet, but this way it is impossible to edit the Midihub, because for that (only) it needs to be connected to the computer directly. This was once possible it seems, as the editor spoke SysEx once (I presume). That way it would have been possible to edit and operate while the Midihub is connected, but only reachable over midi. I would have loved it that way.

I dislike the decision to have to connect directly to a computer to be able to edit a preset. Now I have to use valuable DIN ports…

Anyway, I will get over it, and I’ll manage with limitation, but still, I would have loved the option (and I would not mind the ‘extra’ USB MIDI port that that option would maybe result in) …

Hey, I remember the discussion we had, but in the end, Midihub Editor communicating over USB Serial / COM provides for a better experience across the OSes, so a limitation of iConnectMIDI4+ not being able to pipe through non-MIDI communication to the host does not make sense for us to provide flawed experience for every Midihub user - the extra USBMIDI port, dedicated for programming, can get in the way, especially when Windows gives applications only exclusive access to MIDI, some other app you run may end up blocking it, and the discovery process of which port belongs to Midihub then also gets pretty complicated.

The proper solution would be for iConnectMIDI4+ to handle USB communication better. :slight_smile:


Thanks for your reply, and yes, I do understand your position. I just wanted wine a bit, but like I said, I really like the Midihub, and I will learn to live with this ‘limitation’.

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Apologies if this seems like beating a dead horse, but it remains quite an annoying situation.

As @Joris pointed out in Documentation of Editor Protocol, the other view of the situation is that the iConnectivity boxes are MIDI routers, not USB hubs, so it’s equally arguable that they should not forward any other traffic because it’s not any of its business, and who knows what that other data may be. Also, this is not just about iConnectivity boxes, the same goes for any other MIDI-oriented USB hosts and the like.

Me thinks the ideal situation would be keeping the default setup as is, but additionally support the editor protocol encapsulated in SysEx on any MidiHub port (including DIN!), using this would require manually configuring the MIDI port in the editor (so no autoprobing issues). Having such an option would greatly enhance the flexibility - for example with the MIO boxes you could then run the editor from a remote computer over network (RTP MIDI), which would be seriously neat.

On a kind of related note, just tested running the editor over USB/IP, seems to work fine. The caveat is that a local computer connection is still required, but this way the UI is far, far more responsive than X-forwarding over ssh.

SysEx over USB MIDI compared to COM works slower, and at inconsistent speeds across the 3 major OSes, so going back to it would be a step back for Midihub, as it would close the door for some of the advanced features we’d like to implement like MIDI monitoring in the editor.

I’d be better for everyone if the MIDI routers would step up and route the rest of USB properly too. :slight_smile:

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Please note I wasn’t suggesting “going back” to SysEx, but offering it as an alternative. If that alternative can only support limited subset of serial-connection functionality, it still means people can at least choose the best trade-off for their scenario.

As it is, I effectively lose half of MidiHub IO-capability because the USB has to be connected to a computer rather than the router (switching cables to edit something just doesn’t cut it). For me at least, the choosing between the ability to use USB-MIDI and slightly slower (or even limited) editor experience would be a total no-brainer.

It’s your product and your choice of course, but hoping everybody else change their products to support something that is arguably not in their product scope at all seems a bit cheeky. It’s basically as if somebody asked you to support routing serial modem traffic through MidiHub DIN ports - how would you react? :slight_smile:

Honestly, I’d be completely shocked if sysex over USB midi was functionally slower over even a 12Mbit/s USB 2 connection. Are you actually coming that close to saturating your serial bus over USB? I can understand that the team says “we don’t care to do the dev work”, but performance is a total canard here.

Even though the Full Speed USB link speed theoretically is 12Mbps, it doesn’t mean the OS will give you all of that. We’re not saying things we don’t know about - we’ve tried SysEx communication over USB during the beta of Midihub, the performance of USB MIDI SysEx was very slow, and it was different for each of the major host OSes. It must be limited by the drivers that the OSes provide.

The COM communication is a lot faster in comparison and is a huge improvement for Midihub.